The Amber Room? For reals?

It seems like a long shot to me, but some German treasure hunters think they’ve found the fabled Amber Room in a cavern 65 feet underground.

The discovery of an estimated two tonnes of gold was made at the weekend when electromagnetic pulse measurements located the man-made cavern 20 meters underground near the village of Deutschneudorf on Germany’s border with the Czech Republic.

The team, which used heavy digging equipment, hasn’t been inside the room but analysis of the electromagnetic test has led it to believe that the cavern contains gold.

“I’m well over 90 percent sure we have found the Amber Room,” the mayor of Deutschneudorf, Heinz-Peter Haustein, who led the search, told SPIEGEL ONLINE. “The chamber is likely to be part of a labyrinth of storage rooms that the Nazis built here. I knew it was in this area. I just never knew exactly where.”

The Amber Room was made of 55 square meters of etched and mosaic amber panels backed with gold. A gift from Prussian King Friedrich Wilhelm I to Czar Peter the Great in 1716, it lived in the Catherine Palace until Nazi troops stripped it and shipped it back to East Prussia where it was on display in Königsberg Castle until 1945.

Then it disappeared. Nobody’s sure what happened. Königsberg was hit pretty hard at the end of the war, and the amber was already brittle before it was stripped from the walls in Leningrad.

Then there are theories about it having been packed into a submarine that sank in the Baltic, or stashed in a mineshaft, or hidden in underground cave networks along with piles of other Nazi loot. Hence our current treasure-hunting friends.

Meanwhile, back in St. Petersburg, the Amber Room has been painstakingly recreated. It took Russian artisans and historians, $8 million in German corporate funds, 25 years and 6 tons of amber to do it, but do it they did. Here’s a wall from the recreated Amber Room that gives a sense of its lavish beauty and detail:

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34 Comments »

Comment by Gary Hopkins
2008-02-23 13:43:29

Interesting,similar searches going on in Eastern Canada

Comment by livius drusus
2008-02-23 13:58:48

Erm, really? You mean emp treasure hunts or are people actually looking for the Amber Room all the way in Canada?

 
 
Comment by Clutch
2008-02-24 12:16:45

We already got one! It’s ver’ nice!

Comment by livius drusus
2008-02-24 12:32:45

:lol:

 
Comment by jonesmya
2009-11-18 17:44:57

you a such a liar there is only one amber room in the world you shouldrt lie like that :no: :angry: :blankstare:

 
 
Comment by Pete
2008-03-29 19:38:24

I can’t belive that someone could make a room out of AMBER!!!!!

Comment by livius drusus
2008-03-29 20:50:43

They affixed the amber like a mosaic onto panels, then put the panels all over the walls. It was amazing craftsmanship, no doubt about it.:yes:

Comment by Pete
2008-03-30 14:44:52

Your Absolutly right!

 
 
 
Comment by Anonymous
2009-02-13 12:10:33

Wow realy pretty

Comment by livius drusus
2009-02-13 12:27:24

Very much so. I wouldn’t mind crashing in a room like that. :D

 
 
Comment by anon
2009-08-04 15:12:22

Fantastic article did they find anything

 
Comment by anonpd
2009-08-05 14:59:51

My comment asking if they found anything in the search of 2008, I wrote knowing full well that they did not.
The same as the search undertaken in a lake by divers a few years ago, which also turned up nothing.

The fact of the matter is before both of these attempts, I could have told these people that they were wasting both their time and money.
That its not to say that the original Amber Panels do not exist, they certainly do, but not where they are looking.

Further to that, the speculation of possible locations which have appeared during the past 60 years, are also very wide from the mark.
I suggest that anyone thinking of undertaking any further search to check here first. They would save themselves so much hard work and disappointment.
Believe me, this is certainly NOT an idle claim on my part,

Comment by livius drusus
2009-08-05 15:06:20

And to think I was actually looking for follow-up on the article to answer a trick question. :no:

So am I to understand that you have specific information about the location of the panels?

Comment by anonpd
2009-08-06 17:44:12

Yes, you may certainly do so.

Comment by livius drusus
2009-08-06 18:01:28

Intriguing. I won’t ask you to reveal the GPS coordinates or anything, but I’m terribly curious about how you came to uncover this much sought-after information.

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Comment by anonpd
2009-08-07 17:18:25

Believe it or not this was purely by accident in the first instance, What followed afterwards was a considerable amount of study.
Your interest and the desire to know more is understandable, so allow me to explain a little further.
The Amber Panels are not the only items at this location. The silver candle holders and hard wood floor should also be found there,
together with artefacts removed from German museums.
Any belief that this was a hurried operation to hide these particular articles in the final days of WW11 is misguided.

You will appreciate that once these articles are recovered, the authorities would hopefully in due course return them to their rightful owners.
Which brings me to your question.
There is a full fascinating story of how it is possible to find this location after 60 years. This story,should it ever be told, belongs to me
following the years of effort which went into it.
Hence, how I discovered this can only really be told once everything is recovered.
In anticipation of your next question, Yes I have tried to be heard, very much so.
But I would like you to understand how difficult it is to reach top people who are prepared to listen, without the “we will get back to you” response.
Especially with so many people now convinced that the Red Army burnt the panels by mistake. “Which is totally untrue.” Together with the
false impression that they were destroyed by allied bombing.

Yes, I am very willing to explain recovery details to the right people, those with the power to act. Anything less would be irresponsible.
Meanwhile, I am resigned just to say who is likely to be wasting their efforts looking in the wrong place.

Comment by Charles
2009-08-18 05:21:00

I have now heard everything. What makes you think you know where this place is the KGB looked for years and found nothing and lots of others did too

Comment by anonpd
2009-08-21 15:17:17

You have every right to be sceptical Charles as there have been many attempts to locate the panels.
However I repeat, I do know exactly where the panels were placed along.
As I have said already the location contains many other works of art.
Many of these were destined for Linz Austria, to be housed in a new museum planed to be built there.
How many items were awaiting Linz and how many were placed there to avoid them falling into allied hands I am not sure.
What I can tell you is that the panels were destined for Linz.
Why have so many attempts to find them failed ? I believe the answer to that is simple. “They were looking”
In other words, people made it their mission to find them. They began by Questioning those who where around, went through all old documents
and requested old soldiers to come forward with information.
It may have worked, but with so little to go on and so much false information they ended up chasing dreams.
All of which I believe, began with the false trail left behind at Konigsberg and the mistaken belief that the panels were probably hidden in a hurry.
In reality the very nature of the panels future importance would lead them to being securely hidden, with the location being given its own code name.

Personally, I had no plan to find anything, and that is the truth. As often happens in cases like this, it began purely by a chance event.
Until that time the Amber Room was something I had vaguely heard of years before. What followed afterwards was lots of work.
Charles, this blog it getting long and starting to look like an essay. As I am not sure our host Livius Drusus is ok with this, maybe I
should await his green light. Thanks for your interest.

Comment by livius drusus
2009-08-30 13:16:56

I’m totally okay with it. I’m fascinated, in fact. Do go on.

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Comment by anonpd
2009-09-04 16:08:55

Livius Drusus, thanks for your good will. Rest assured that what I have written is not a hoax.

Continued:
Remember during WW11 both sides had their respective misinformation units, with the sole aim of fooling the opposing side.
A case in point was the allied deception which became known as “The man who never was” This particular incident was made into a film after the war.
Another was the huge undertaking carried out in the south east of England, which involved the building of tanks, lorries, and planes “from wood and canvas”
All with the aim of deceiving the German high command as to where the actual invasion of Northern France was to take place.
The value of misinformation and deception was well known to both sides. They also had the resources and personnel to carry out such tasks when the need arose.
One only needs to remember the huge amount of “forged” foreign currency discovered after the war to realise the extent of these endeavours.

This brings us to the ruse which took place in the castle at Konisburg, a prime reason I believe why the panels have never been found.
If you are told something burnt, why waste time looking further. A great deception, with the added advantage that blame could then be placed on Allied bombing,
these being the same allies to which Russia herself belonged ! That was clever.

Yes, there has been many searches and much written, although very little has touched upon the truth.
For example just how much effort went into trying to decipher the letters BSCH which were found (conveniently) in a message at the end of the war, which
went on to say that an entrance had been blown up; another great piece of deception which had everyone guessing. Or the conviction that the panels
lay at the bottom of the sea, in the ill-fated ship the Gustava Willheim. “Why”, because someone had reported seeing boxes being loaded !
I would think any ship about to sail would take onboard many boxes.
In reality the panels had long gone to a safe location to await another day. A location from which they could be recovered without too much difficulty
(a point which seems to have been overlooked ), I say this with the knowledge of how this was achieved and where.

One point of interest which I believe can be cleared up, is this:
It was widely reported that before he died, the Gautier Erich Kock stated that “where lay his own treasure ( loot ) would be found the Amber room”.
This has always begged the question, if he knew that, why did he not use this knowledge to help with his own defence.
I believe he was telling the truth. However, the reason he did not elaborate was simple, he had no idea where that final destination was,
only that his treasure had been stored together with the panels in a top secret location. It is very unlikely that he was actually told where, or even needed to
know at that point in time. Whether or not his things travelled with the panels or followed later I am not sure, although the fact that he was aware
they ended up together, leads me to believe that they were moved at the same time.

During the past two weeks, I have learnt of yet another TV programme screened in Germany, which apparently follows a team searching beneath a Castle there.
Whatever else they may find, it will definitely NOT include the panels.

 
Comment by anonpd
2009-09-04 16:32:26

Sorry can you ignore above, in my haste to give you more I have made some errors which I have amended below…..my apologies

Livius Drusus, thanks for your good will. Rest assured that what I have written is not a hoax.

Continued:
During WW11 both sides had their respective misinformation units, with the sole aim of fooling the opposing side.
A case in point was the allied deception which became known as “The man who never was” This particular incident was made into a film after the war.
Another was the huge undertaking carried out in the South East of England, which involved the building of tanks, lorries, and planes “from wood and canvas”
With the aim of deceiving the German high command as to where the actual invasion of Northern France was to take place.
The value of deception was well known to both sides. They also had the resources and personnel to carry out such tasks when the need arose.
One only needs to remember the huge amount of “forged” foreign currency discovered after the war to realise the extent and detail these operations called for.

This brings us to the ruse which took place in the castle at Konisgsberg, a prime reason I believe why the panels have never been found.
If you are told something burnt, why waste time looking further. A great deception, with the added advantage that blame could then be placed on Allied bombing,
these being the same allies to which Russia herself belonged ! That was clever.

Yes, there has been many searches and much written, although very little has touched upon the truth.
For example just how much effort went into trying to decipher the letters BSCH which were found (conveniently) in a message at the end of the war, which
went on to say that an entrance had been blown up; another great piece of deception which had everyone guessing. Or the conviction that the panels
lay at the bottom of the Baltic sea, in the ill-fated ship the Wilhelm Gustloff. “Why”, because someone had reported seeing boxes being loaded !
I believe any ship about to sail would take onboard many boxes.
In reality the panels had long gone to a safe location to await another day. A location from which they could be recovered without too much difficulty
(a point which seems to have been overlooked ), This I can say knowing exactly how it was achieved.

One mystery which I believe is possible to clear up, is this:
It was widely reported that before he died, the Gauleiter Erich Koch stated that “where lay his own treasure ( loot ) would be found the Amber room”.
This has always begged the question, if he knew that, why did he not use this knowledge to help with his own defence.
I believe he was telling the truth. However, the reason he did not elaborate was simple, he had no idea where that final destination was,
only that his treasure had been stored together with the panels in a top secret location. It is very unlikely that he was actually told where, or even needed to
know at that point in time. Whether or not his things travelled with the panels or followed later I am not sure, although the fact that he knew
they were put together, leads me to believe that they were moved at the same time.

During the past two weeks, I have learnt of yet another TV programme screened in Germany, which apparently follows a team searching beneath a Castle there.
Whatever else they may find, it will definitely NOT include the panels.

Comment by Anonymous
2009-09-18 15:13:12

To anonpd – I would like to hear more about your statement “Yes, I am very willing to explain recovery details to the right people, those with the power to act.” Who do you feel are the right people? I happen to know someone who might qualify.

Comment by Anonpd
2009-10-02 17:10:11

Sorry but holidays took over…

The location is in Germany, so unless someone has contact with the higher reaches of Goverment in that country there is little point in pursing things.
Which is really what I was referring to when I spoke about the right people.
Without knowing who you had in mind it is difficult to evaluate your offer. Maybe you could just indicate the position this person holds, without the details.
Sad as it may seem, if the authorities wished to recover the items nothing would be easier in regards to the location and the likely cost.
Thanks for your interest, I will listen to any ideas.

 
 
 
Comment by Anonpd
2010-01-21 06:03:35

19 Jan 2010

Yesterday I read of yet another attempt to locate the amber panels.
This time in Kaliningrad, at a spot near to where the old castle of Konigberg once stood.
Whatever they may find at this location, it certainly will not include the amber panels.
As previously stated above, the panels will only be found in Germany.

http://www.archaeologydaily.com/news/201001183083/Priceless-Amber-Room-of-the-Tsars-looted-and-hidden-by-the-Nazis-is-found.html

Comment by livius drusus
2010-01-21 16:25:23

He doesn’t seem to have any evidence whatsoever that the amber panels are in the bunker. I guess we’ll see at the end of the month, or what’s more likely, we’ll just never hear about it again.

Comment by Anonpd
2010-03-10 16:43:20

Livius Drusus,

It seems our predictions were correct, nothing was found and there has been no word since.

The truth of the matter is: the panels were never in Konisgsberg and that is a fact, however difficult this will be for some to accept,
especially after the millions of words written on the subject these past 60 years.

My understanding is that there was no space and it was unsuitable.
As I said earlier the whole episode in Konisgsberg was a complete hoax, to which I may add Dr Rohde was fully involved in.
The panels were however sent to a location in Poland until 1944, it was at this location that the photos were taken which appeared later in Germany.
So, neither allied bombs, the Russian Army, or German army destroyed any panels in Konisgsberg, they simply never went there and that is the truth
I hope this helps to clear the confusion surrounding Dr Rohdes trips away from Konisgsberg, and the many conflicting stories originating
from there concerning the panels.

Like many events during this time, the Germany Army recorded the hoax on film and this will be found eventual together with the Panels.
Whether I am believed or not, I can assure you that which I have written above is a small part of the true events which happened.

 
 
 
Comment by Sarah M
2010-03-25 16:46:51

Anonpd, I am curious… where do you live?

Comment by livius drusus
2010-03-25 20:06:42

Don’t tell her, Anonpd! She’s probably trying to get the Amber Room all for herself.

 
Comment by Anonpd
2010-04-03 10:12:19

Sarah M

Thanks for your interest, but where I live hardly matters. If you have any special interest in the subject apart from the one
our host livius drusus has suggested then please let me know.

 
 
Comment by Anonpd
2010-05-11 17:47:22

Livius drusus
I read with interest the latest posting referring to the discovery of a likely Raphael original.
( Possible Raphael found in storage )

It may also interest your readers to know that another painting of Raphael’s that of a “Young Man” still exists.
My understanding is that this painting along with many others will be found together with the Amber panels.
These include not only old masters, but paintings by the 20th century German artist Emil, who’s work was considered degenerate by Hitler.
Fortunately, it would appear that not everyone thought the same as Hitler, as I understand some of Emil’s paintings were saved from being burnt.

 
Comment by anon
2012-01-16 08:57:49

I have read your comments why can,t you tell us more what other things are at this place and how do know all this did someone tell you.maybe you are wrong can you prove it?

 
Comment by Anonpd
2012-02-16 16:48:23

In reply to the above comment posted 16.1.12

I was not “told” anything. This information comes from a message written in code by an officer in the German army and a member of the ERR. An organisation set up by Alfred Rosenberg to plunder art.

The officer was captured near Budapest during the final stages of WW11 and sent to Russia.

It was from there ( some years later due to Russian restrictions ) that he managed to send out a letter with the Red Cross.

His letter also contained the message in code, a code which took a considerable amount of time to decode and fully understand.

Having done so, I can only confirm that everything he wrote checks out completely. His full name, rank and unit, his mother’s name, father’s name, and his wife’s name. Where he attended school and college and who he worked for as PA during the war. He also names the POW camp where he was being held.

Not only does he tell exactly what happened to the Amber panels and where they are to be found, he also names a few of the hundreds of paintings stored there, some of which belong to Germany and others which do not.

Two of the paintings named are by the German artist Menzels, one is The Flute Player, the other Dinner at the Round Table.

He names the painting Ecce Homo which is also there, plus the one I spoke of earlier, Portrait of a young man, by Raphael.

During the early part of the war I believe he was sent to Paris in his capacity as PA, where he met Rose Valland, she being the very brave woman who worked at the French art Gallery Jue de Pame in Paris.

My understanding is that besides the Amber Panels and Paintings at the location, there are other items which were removed from Berlin and its Museums.

In my earlier comments I said the location was given its own code name. This same code name was mentioned in German documents found after the war, but the location was never found.

The construction of the message and its contents clearly show the officer was well educated in the arts and fluent in at least 3 languages, he was also a German patriot as he states in the message “It is art that he owes the Nation”.

If this statement is true, it would not only prove how very few people knew where this location was, it would also show his concern for the art stored there and its possible loss to future generations.

One example: In his message he details how an item of National importance to Germany was dismantled and removed to safety, an item which to this day is still recorded incorrectly in German records as being lost.

To answer your final question. Yes, I have proof of the age of the message, which also shows how it was completely misunderstood when it was first received many years ago.

 
Comment by Emily
2013-03-22 15:45:36

http://www.angelfire.com/pa/ImperialRussian/news/322news.html
Has there been any further news from Herr Gluba’s attempt to excavate the underground bunker?

 
Comment by Anonpd
2013-09-22 15:29:09

I would like to comment on an article which I saw recently on the following web site
http://www.city-data.com/forum/history/1631730-worlds-greatest-lost-treasure.html
This contains a reference to this website and my postings under anonpd.

The posting by NJGOAT on the web site above, appear to find these postings on the History blog interesting and quotes a small part of my postings.
These are followed by a person identified as ERASURE, who seems to deride the whole concept that the room survived at all.
To begin with I would like to thank NJGOAT for showing an interest in this and for giving me what appears to be the support of an open mind in some way.
To ERASURE I can only say that you are completely wrong in your conclusions.
If amber was so very fragile there would be nothing, or very little remaining from the millions and millions of articles produced from the material over the centuries.
In this case, German efficiency would have ensured that everything was labelled and well packed.
In the officers own words “Hitler’s pipe dream for Linz” would have been well cared for.

The amber panels were looked after by Dr Alfred Rohde in the place where they were stored prior to their removal to Germany. However the storage place was NOT in the castle of Konigsberg.
To use the same word the officer used in his message, I quote. The whole episode in Konigsberg was, “a sting” which was carried out by himself and Dr Rohde. This involved taking pictures of the panels to accompany an article prepared by Dr Rohde, which appeared later in the German Pantheon Art Digest. The pictures that appeared with the article were faked creating the false impression that the panels were on display in the castle of Konigsberg. It also explains why Hitler was not present at this sham event. The reason the officer gives for this deception was in his own words, “to stop air raids on the castle”. Whoever planned this deception knew that any information of this nature, published in Berlin would certainly reach the ears of the allies. With the castle being used by the German high command at the time it would seem a useful diversion. Although Dr Rohde had an office within the castle it was reported that he was often away. Yes, he was away, attending to the panels of amber which were housed at an entirely different location.
The supposed fire in the castle of Konigsberg at later date was all part of the “sting”. What actually got burnt there were rubber tires.
Yes, the castle was bombed eventually, but I believe that happened much later.

The officer, who compiled the message, had a very interesting life and a definite claim to fame, long before the start of WW11. I have researched his claim to fame and his identity and found it to be 100% correct.
Earlier in these posting I mentioned Rose Valland, of the Jeu de Paume Museum in Paris.
I said only that the officer knew her as she is mentioned, but on further scrutiny of his message I believe he was actually saying she had compiled a file for him of people to whom some of the art had previously belonged. The file which should be found together with the hundreds of other stored items will certainly not contain information regarding the Russian, German and Polish art.
If the file originated in France it is likely to contain information of previous owners of art from that country, it may name collections rather than single pieces from individuals.
It is well known that albums were prepared at the museum in France to be sent to Germany to be seen by the top brass there. So the file may include some art which went to these high ranking German officers instead of being sent to the secret location, in which case some of that art may have already been found in private homes and reclaimed after the war.

Should anyone believe this location to be a minor holding they are in for a shock. My understanding is that it contains as much, if not more, than that previously found in other locations after the war.

Of course the officer’s message contains far more information than that which I have spoken of here.
It details where in Poland the panels went to first, how and when they were moved, and exactly where they were sent to. In great detail it explains how they are to be recovered, and what is to be found there.
With this in mind I have written to various people whom I thought may show an interest in recovering their own National treasures, but alas, it would seem they do not believe me, or they would have posted a response.
I understand the scepticism of people reading these postings and the many postings and articles to be found on the internet, however, I can assure anyone reading this that the truth surrounding the disappearance of the Amber panels is only to be found on this one.

ANONPD

 
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